Top photo: Fight HST Strategist Bill Tieleman and campaigner Eddie Petrossian with CBC TV; bottom photo: protestors - including Shirley Ross - centre - on West 4th Avenue got enormous support from vehicles passing byFight HST had a great protest rally outside Premier Gordon Campbell's constituency office in Vancouver-Point Grey riding on Saturday afternoon, with about 60 people encouraging support for efforts to kill the Harmonized Sales Tax.
At times cars and trucks honking horns to show backing for Fight HST created an overwhelming noise on West 4th Avenue.
Fight HST campaigners from across Metro Vancouver set up on both sides of the street in front of and across from Campbell's office, while more protestors were stationed at the corners of West 4th and Alma.
The message was clear from their signs - hold a fair, democratic and binding referendum on the HST soon or face Recall campaigns against BC Liberal MLAs.
Prominent among the Fight HST supporters were those organizing a potential Recall against BC Liberal Finance Minister Colin Hansen.
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29 comments:
I want to thank all of the protesters for taking their time to stand up for the rest of us who had to work or family obligations that kept them away. We aren't going to go away and the Recall is not a threat it is "reality"!!!!
Louella Vincent
Knowing Campbell as we do, will hide and skulk, as he usually does. Such as, refusing to have a fall sitting, in the Legislature, among many other things. He's the behind your back, sort of person, as is Hansen. The gall of, urging the people to read the Sun newspaper. We all know the Sun, can't be taken seriously. That paper is, a propaganda sheet, for Campbell. Like they think, we didn't notice that. I believe we should have just went right to recall. It just isn't possible to shame Campbell, nor Hansen. It wasn't beneath their dignity, to lie, deceive and cheat to win. Rally's are a good way, to make people more aware, of how much peril we are in, because of Campbell.
Is the antiHST/recall campaign hurting themselves by 'allowing' some of their leadership to be distracted with personal provincial political ambitions?
Wow, 40-60 people occupying the sidewalk spread out over what, 4 locations. You must be proud of this accomplishment. "Fight HST had a great protest rally . . . in Vancouver-Point Grey . . . Saturday afternoon"
Crimeny you are proud of this embarrassment. I take to the streets (note I said streets, not sidewalks) protesting serious injustices regularly. A few hundred is the minimum we need to make me feel we have their attention.
It takes so little to make you happy, Bill. Why, you don't even want Recall. Are you nuts? Our whole system of government is chaotic, we should be recalling NDP MLA's as well.
Sorry, my proofreader has reminded me, you like our system just fine. I suppose you're right as always. GO HST!! It's here as long as the Liberals are and they aren't going anytime soon.
And there's always the backup plan. In case Liberals become an endangered species, NDP will be there to keep the HST going. I love BC politics, let me know when the bill for this show surpasses $1.6 billion.
The BC people, were very fortunate, that the Zalm, Tielman and the rest of the good people who, worked so very hard, to fight the unfair HST, that was, out and out crammed down our throats. The provincial budget was bad enough, for tax hikes, add the HST on pretty much everything, this is going to be a tough winter. Evictions, have already started and there are sure to be utility cut offs as well. Campbell and Hansen, will have to be watched, very carefully. Read Rafe Mair's Common Sense Canadian. There is going to be some, mega pollution done by, the gruesome twosome, so heads up everybody.
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A tip o'the tuque to you, Bill ... good to hear that sidewalk demonstrations are so well received. People do care.
It'd be nice to see information pickets on the steps of Vancouver Law Courts when the BC Rail Political Corruption Trial gets rolling again.
Doesn't need to be big. It just needs to be there ... the way you did it, at Gordo's office. Thanks again for that.
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Bill, I don't agree with you about a lot of things but I admire your courage for getting out there in front of Mr. Campbell's office and making your point. It would doubtless have gone over better had it been publicized more.
Big deal. A show for the TV news.
Not much courage either.
What would be courage is to take a proactive direction and go after the NDP directly as to how they would defeat the HST six months after assuming office in 2013.
What would be courage is for Bill T. to stand up in front of an NDP audiuence at the next NDP convention and tell James to simply defeat it. No renegotiations no nothing.
It would take that long to draft the legislation, and go through debates in the Legislature in the fall.
A majority NDP vote will kill the HST if the people don't in next year's referendum.
The people doing the protest took the time to do just that, protest. They took the time to do so. But some folks prefer to try to belittle the ones who showed up. The Fight HST isn't going away anytime soon. I noticed on a local TV station this morning that the two recalls groups here in Victoria have a large bunch of workers getting ready
"The people doing the protest took the time to do just that, protest. They took the time to do so. But some folks prefer to try to belittle the ones who showed up. The Fight HST isn't going away anytime soon. I noticed on a local TV station this morning that the two recalls groups here in Victoria have a large bunch of workers getting ready"
and so that has more value than an obviously staged "protest" about the obvious. Protests work if there is something new about them, the reasoning behind the protest in front of Campbell's office is hardly new.
Anyone can hold up a sign.
and as for those collection of canvassers from Fight BC, Fight BC doesn't have a monopoly on just who gets to start a recall campaign.
Once can be started on November 16whether FightBC is there or not.
I'd rather get one or two started on November 16 just to start the process.
What did this protest accomplish DPL? Nothing you say. Okay, I said it for you but I wonder what your argument would be if you disagreed. The HST is still here, right? You know why Fight HST isn't going away anytime soon? Because the HST isn't going away anytime soon. The Liberals didn't seem to care about the 550,000 signatures . Why should they give a damn about 50 or so people standing around ? "Well they were waving pieces of cardboard too!" Oh, yeah, that would scare the snot out of me also, if that was all I had for brains.
Look at it this way, DPL. Some people take the time to explain why this whole exercise was doomed from the start and how Mr. Tieleman is deceiving people into believing they have the power to affect democratic change when he actually helped make the HST a reality in the first place. But some try to belittle those who speak the truth. Congratulations to the Victoria area recall groups for generating massive support for their campaign. I promise to offer you a full apology when they achieve a minimum level of success. I'm going to set that level at one notch above diddly squat.
Next time you are doing a protest why not simply stand around with a sign that reads “I am a loser” It is a more candid and direct approach yes but you may as well admit to the obvious. It amazes me that some people have so little going on in your lives. Maybe next you protest against the property purchaser’s tax. You can protest outside of VanderZalm’s house.
wow, there are some really bitter negative comments here.
Why would these posters be so bent out of shape about some citizens exercising their democratic rights and protesting?
This is Canada, technically we're still a democracy.
And Bill T and the other Fight-HST folks are our best chance of having a real democracy again, not a four-year dictatorship (with only half the electorate even voting).
wow, there are some really bitter negative comments here.
Why would these posters be so bent out of shape about some citizens protesting and exercising their democratic rights?
This is Canada, technically we're still a democracy.
Bill T and the other Fight-HST folks are our best chance of having a real democracy again, not a four-year dictatorship (where only half the electorate even vote).
Bill, being a semi-retarded country mouse, myself, I can't understand how it is that as the aptly named "monkeyman" says:
"Mr. Tieleman is deceiving people into believing they have the power to affect democratic change when he actually helped make the HST a reality in the first place."
Your comment boards seem to have taken the place of the closed down institutions for the mentally disabled - or are the PABsters so freaked out and being fed so much crystal meth to cope with trying to change reality that it just seems that way?
Good work Bill! It seems you have rattled gordo "the impalers" PABsmears with this article. When will they realize that democracy will be done. Not with their interference, and not with their lies. RECALL NOW!
Kam Lee
Kam:
Not everyone here who writes in opposition to the antics or commentary of bloggers are from PAB. Far from it.
Recall in the fall? So what happened to that. Seems VanderZalm and Delaney are calling the shots as to when recall "must" begin as opposed to anyone in a riding where there is a chance of recall happening deciding for themselves.
Campbell begged the BC people's forgiveness, when he got his, criminal charge of his DUI. He then turned around, and kicked those very people, in the face. He lied about, his corrupt sale, of the BC Railroad. He was going to honor hospital contracts. He honored those contracts by, tearing them up. We now have dirty hospitals, full of super bugs. He arrogantly, threw a loony at, Paramedics who only get $2.00 per hour for standby. Campbell also kicked the children, living in poverty, in the face, their numbers are growing, everyday. Campbell is proud of his, $6.00 per hour, minimum wage. He also arrogantly, gave his useless self a, 53% wage hike. His $2 million per year pension, isn't too shabby either. Campbell gave his useless ministers, a 29% raise in pay. 90% of BC citizens, despise Campbell and Hansen, and hate everything they stand for.
Thanks for the comments - and good to see there's a bit of life left in BC Liberals! Not to mention the bitter taste in their mouths of the HST.
As to Anon 10:17 a.m. - I have been very clear throughout this entire anti-HST campaign - I want the HST eliminated immediately.
I strongly disagree with the current BC NDP position - I do not want notice given for a renegotiation at the end of the 5 year term - a binding referendum saying NO to the HST is all the mandate the province requires to tell the federal Conservative government it is getting out.
Repay the HST implementation money from Ottawa, restore the PST and do it soon - that's my position and I've said it publicly many times before in the media and will continue to do so.
I hope the NDP will adopt the same position - certainly it is the view of the overwhelming majority of NDP members - and British Columbians.
"Repay the HST implementation money from Ottawa, restore the PST and do it soon - that's my position and I've said it publicly many times before in the media and will continue to do so."
Kind of simplistic. So where does that $1 billion come from since it has already been spent? Does the PST return to what it was before with GST or is there a continuation of what is currently taxed under the HST?
Since equivalent GST taxes are now within BC as the HST it would mean a net loss of sales tax from BC back to Ottawa. What then? What is taxed to make up the difference, since the GST taxes assessed wouldn't be coming back to BC 100%.
Don't like the HST, but never liked VanderZalm's Property Transfer Tax either.
Anon 2:18 - It is simple.
Ottawa gave BC $1.6 billion for imposing the HST - that amount, pro-rated, should be repaid.
Where does the money come from? Where it always does - from taxpayers.
But more precisely, since Finance Minister Colin Hansen says BC will have an extra $2.7 billion more over the next 4 years than budgeted and since BC has reduced the projected deficit by $335 million, paying Ottawa back should be no problem without cutting any public services.
Yes, the PST and GST return as they were June 30.
Ottawa's portion of the GST never changed so I don't understand your other point - the feds will still get their 5% GST as previously.
As to the Property Purchase Tax, there have been 19 years of NDP and then BC Liberal governments since Social Credit disappeared in 1991 - and it's still there.
As opposed to the HST, which doesn't give a dime to public services but transfers $2 billion a year from consumers to big business, the PPT provides revenue to the province.
If you want to get rid of it, either services get cut or other taxes go up.
kootcoot, Kam and of course the insufferable Bill T, what is wrong with you people? Is your definition of a PABster or simply Liberal - "anyone who disagrees with popular opinion on this blog"?
There are other negative responses but I am assuming mine is one being accused of being a Liberal supporter. kootcoot, if you believe that I am from PAB then perhaps you're the one on crystal meth.
off-the-radar says "technically we're still a democracy. And Bill T . . . our best chance of having a real democracy again, not a four-year dictatorship"
Bill, would you please explain to off-the-radar and kootcoot how you campaigned extensively to keep our voting system the way it is, regularly producing majority victories which enable the winner to run the province as a four-year dictatorship?
By the way Bill, I believe the taste of HST is sweet in Liberal mouths but bitter in yours. And where do you expect to find this binding referendum?
"I hope the NDP will adopt the same position - certainly it is the view of the overwhelming majority of NDP members - and British Columbians."
Apparently the view of the majority is no more important to the NDP elite than it is to the Liberal elite. So how do any of you expect to be treated fairly no matter which of these sleazy parties gains control on any given election day?
Technically a democracy? That's being generous. Bill Tieleman supports majority dictatorships. How can democratic change be affected under such conditions? Does that help you understand kootcoot? off-the-radar?
I know Bill doesn't understand, doubt he ever will. And what can I say about Kam "I disagree with you so you must be PAB" Lee? Have you considered taking a course in constructive thinking? If it works for you suggest it to your buddies.
Monkey Man - we'll take your anonymous word that you don't work for PAB - not that if you did you'd be inclined to admit it here!
But I'm convinced because it's obvious you are another disgruntled Single Transferrable Vote advocate who is deluded into thinking that bad things like the HST would never happen under STV.
Oh for the sweetness and light of Ireland, where nary a disagreeable word is spoken and every politician reports daily to voters for their democratic marching orders - or they will be toast.
The reality - some of the most entrenched, ward-heeling, established interest politicians in the world thanks to the Irish STV.
You could look it up Monkey Man but you won't - better to believe in your myth than face reality.
@ monkey man
I totally support proportional representation---as per the New Zealand and Germany models but . . . STV??!
Wtf? you're kidding me right? have you even looked at Ireland? it is not a healthy democracy, far from it sadly, a lot of corruption and scandal. And oh that other bastion of democracy, Malta. LMAO.
STV, what a nightmare that would have been. There was a reason nobody could understand it or explain it, not even its staunchest advocates---because it was inexplicable.
And STV would have allowed the Liberals to gerrymander every election from now to kingdom come.
And you're skulking around here bitterly dissing Bill T on his own blog?
How are you contributing to this province? How are you motivating people to be active citizens and move forward and reclaim our province and government?
I totally admire people like Bill T, Chris Delaney and Bill Vander Zalm and the 7,000 volunteers and the 700,000 British Columbians that signed the anti HST petition. People coming together and working together to make a difference.
Now that is democracy in action and people who care about our province.
It's not too late, stop being bitter and do something positive.
One of the few times I will admit you're right, Bill. Obviously no-one would admit to being PAB here but what can you do when you won't accept facts.
I didn't actually notice you mention that you fought hard to keep FPTP but I assume most people here are well aware of that.
But I didn't see in your reply where you conceded that FPTP usually produces majorities in BC.
I also failed to find the part where you admit that the province is run like a dictatorship, despite nearly everybody here pointing that out.
These are facts.
You avoid them.
And again, your thoughts on the mysterious binding referendum?
off-the-radar I'm guessing is Bill's cousin. Must be related because the same meaningless arguments are laid down. Ireland and Malta. As if that somehow justifies FPTP, the second worst system going.
And the worse one? Yup, MMP. Where we can have politicians elected off the party list without them actually receiving votes. Thanks but no thanks Einstein. Let's see what else the genius had to offer.
- STV is inexplicable.
- Liberals will gerrymander elections forever.
- Totally admire political opportunists, 7,000 sheeple, and 700,000 BC'ers - whoops 550,000, apparently a sizeable percentage of the Fight HST supporters have trouble with signing their name or knowing their address or something - coming together to make a difference.
And the difference between HST before and HST after? Sorry for asking the tough questions.
How am I motivating people to be active citizens and move forward and reclaim our province and government? By constantly pointing out the problem inherent in our system of government.
By the way, did anyone notice where I said that STV is the answer? That's right, I didn't. Changing how government is bestowed with power will not solve the problem because the problem IS government power, or to be more specific, abuse thereof.
Changing party in power by "reclaiming government" is meaningless. No democratic effort will force those in power to relinquish control. The Liberals will be ousted at some point but of course they're not the power in control.
Government serves those with money and uses armed gangs to enforce their will. Not everyone is willing to accept this as reality and even fewer will stand up to these injustices. I am, so are many others but we are certainly still too small to have any effect at this time.
Bitter? Not any more. What you call dissing, I call holding Bill, or anyone fooled by his song and dance, accountable. Instead of preaching to the converted I simply point out how ridiculous Bill's contradictory arguments are and what a pathetic waste of time it is to try to work within a faulty system.
Anytime I can convince a non-Liberal supporter that reads here regularly to stop buying what Bill is selling, then we're one step closer to ridding ourselves of what ails us. Our "democracy".
STV Irish model? Great Caesar's Salad. That was the biggest error from the STV advocates, using the Irish model. Ireland is a very small country compared to BC, and BC doesn't need fiefdoms.
A better model would have been what is used in Australia, use the single transferrable ballot to elect one person per riding as they do there for both State and federal elections.
If the Australian model was proposed and brought forward and adapted for BC, then I would have voted STV.
Having multiple member ridings creates alot of headaches for the voters and for the parties.
Would an NDPer and Liberals share an office? Obviously not, and who does one go to for assistance in government bureaucracy matters?
and those nominations. Who becomes the better of the candidates to nominate and there's obvously the matter of slates, complicating something that should nominate just one candidate.
Then amongst the 3 Liberals within one riding or 3 NDPers in another one, the one MLA in each would want "power" over the others.
and Bill, in regards to elected dictatorships, didn't we have such a thing when the NDP was in power?
We were told the restaurants never did pay PST. It was set up that way to get their support for a corrupt Liberal party.
We very seldom eat out and never tip. Tipping is basically another scam. Let the restaurant owners pay their help a decent wage.If it wasn't for alcohol half of them would be shut down now. The HST will never be fair to BC taxpayers. All right wing governments are very corrupt.
Campbell and his clones are setting themselves up for employment when they are turfed out of office. We believe a democracy stands a better chance of surviving under an NDP government. We presently have a democratic system for corrupt corporations,foreigners and their shareholders. Will this HST money
end up in Swiss Banks?
Never tip either. Why tip for average service, HST rhetoric or no HST rhetoric.
Helps pay the wage of the low paying waitresses? Not my problem.
Why demean the true heroes standing to receive BC's highest honour by dragging Gordo's name into the whole thing?
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