Tuesday, April 08, 2008

Olympic Games making Chinese repression worse, not better

Bill Tieleman’s 24 Hours Column
Tuesday April 8, 2008


Let's boycott China altogether

By BILL TIELEMAN

It is increasingly clear that much of the current wave of repression is occurring not in spite of the Olympics, but actually because of the Olympics.

- Amnesty International, April 1, 2008

Boycott the Chinese Olympic games?

How about we just boycott China?

A country run by a vicious military dictatorship should never have been awarded the 2008 summer Olympics in the first place - and that was before its repressive attacks on Tibet.

Despite pious claims by China's leaders that it would improve human rights and allow foreign journalists full freedom to report on the Olympics, the reality is that new crackdowns are doing exactly the opposite.

On Thursday, Chinese human rights advocate Hu Jia was sentenced to three and a half years in jail for "subversion." Jia is a cyber dissident whose popular Internet blog posted articles about Chinese human rights violations and corruption.

On Friday, the CBC sent a protest letter to Lu Shumin, China's ambassador to Canada, because its websites have been blocked by the Chinese authorities for months.

And CBC is actually the official Canadian broadcaster of the Beijing Olympic Games.

Then there is the ongoing Chinese effort to isolate and intimidate Taiwan, a democratic country it claims as its own property.

The extent of Chinese bullying can be seen in its successful pressure to ban Taiwan from the World Health Organization, an international body that states: "Health is a shared responsibility, involving equitable access to essential care and collective defence against transnational threats."

Except, that is, if China objects. And it doesn't stop at the WHO. China has even blocked Taiwanese reporters from being accredited to cover the World Health Assembly since 2004, despite objections from journalistic organizations.

Perhaps it's threatening to the communist dictatorship if Taiwan newspapers and television tell the country's 23 million people about illnesses like the avian flu that know no borders.

We mustn't forget Tibet, where the paranoid Chinese government blames the Noble Peace Prize winner, the Dalai Lama, for Tibetans protesting the ongoing occupation of their country.

Ambassador Shumin actually went on Canadian television to call the Dalai Lama a "liar" and compare Tibet's government prior to the Chinese takeover with the Nazis.

Perhaps Shumin would enjoy another TV appearance to explain his government's appalling treatment of Falun Gong practioners and other dissidents as well, but I doubt it.

Prime Minister Stephen Harper has rightly decided not to attend the opening of the Beijing Olympics to send a clear signal that China's behaviour is offensive to the world.

And if China, our second largest trading partner, retaliates? Yes, we'll just have to make do without poisonous lead toys for our children and contaminated food products. That will be tough.

57 comments:

Anonymous said...

I recently heard a Rick Mercer rant re: Canada giving China huge amounts of money in annual foreign aid. I'm not sure if the rant was new or old, but it seemed ridiculous that we would be giving that government any money at all. Does anyone know if we do, how much, and why?

Gary E said...

I couldn't help but laugh at your paragraph on the Chinese government telling everybody that they would do one thing and then turn around and do the exact opposite. Sounds like a page right out of the Province of BC.

Li Hou said...

This Dalai Lama was a lord of slaves before he escaped. Dalai Lamas were appointed by Chinese government for over 200 hundreds years.The Tibetant attacked and killed Han Chinese in Lasha at beginning. It was observed by visitors even from Canada. The Chinese government must protect common citizens.

Anonymous said...

I heard one newsource that Stephen Harper had made the decision to not attend the opening ceremonies prior to all the violence in Tibet. Please Bill, don't give him credit for this one.

I find it quite frightening that the corporate mafia is enabling this country to become the world's next superpower. "Profit urber alles"

Anonymous said...

Have you gone completely insane?? How much do you know about China, how much do you know about Chinese history? Do you know what the the truth really is?? Your distorted opinions have just approved that you are pathetic. You heard Canada giving China money? Come on, give me a break. If you ever gonna move your butt and learn more about the relationship between China and Canada, you will find how exactly the opposite is true. If you ever go to Walmart or London Drugs to buy sth, then shut the fuck up! The truth really is that you are afraid, scared and jealous about China's economic development. Shitting sth here just make you feel better???? PATHETIC!!!

Anonymous said...

If you think Tibet is a country, Qubec is also a country and All indian people here should set up their own country.

You white people should get out of North America. This land has belonged to Indian people for a long time.
Don't you know it was you white people who killed millions of Indian people and occupied their land in history?

Budd Campbell said...

Bill, are you recommending a total trade boycott against China, similar to what the US did till the 1970s, and similar to what it still has in place with Cuba? Or for that matter, similar to our own national policy towards South Africa in the last years of apartheid? If so, I think it would involve a lot more than crumby toys.

Anonymous said...

Hi Bill,
It seems to me that your suggestion is a bit too 'anti-Chinese people' and not enough 'anti-Chinese government.' I can't help but think of the suffering a large-scale economic boycott could cause my friends there. I don't know what the solution is to this situation which seems to be turning into more and more of a hate-fest every day, but I think your anger is a bit scary and reactionary. Also, I think you demonstrate a lack of understanding in terms of how intertwined Canada and China's economies are. I don't think such a proposal would be simple to implement. I understand that people are upset, indeed I hate a lot of the policies of the Chinese government, but I also know that stuff like this increases the paranoia of the government and of many many Chinese people who see the reactions as the West's desire to prevent China from succeeding. I have no idea how to fix that perception, though. I feel overwhelmed by all the stuff I keep reading.

And, of course, I also feel annoyed by postings from nationalistic people like Li Hou who feel compelled to 'educate' me. Yes, people were killed in Lhasa. That is awful. However, the Chinese government's continuing refusal to allow in reporters to see what is actually happening makes people much less inclined to be sympathetic. Also, the refusal of people like Li Hou to reflect critically on what triggered Tibetans to react so violently is very frustrating.

Still, it is important to note that not all Chinese people are speaking with the same voice: http://chinadigitaltimes.net/2008/03/twelve-suggestions-for-dealing-with-the-tibetan-situation-by-some-chinese-intellectuals/
http://www.zonaeuropa.com/200804061.htm

The situation is complicated, emotional and unstable. I hope things get better soon.

Meist Mordarto said...

First of all, typically, the Dalai Lama is not appointed. He is selected via a reincarnation process, despite what Chinese state media/"history" textbooks might say. Please do more research before making outlandish claims. Of course, we're talking about China, who went ahead and kidnapped the Panchen Lama and appointed a new one, who is conveniently, a son of Communist party members.

And to the person equating Quebec to Tibet, please realize that the people of Quebec have a right to VOTE for their future. I don't think people can do that yet in authoritarian Communist China, especially with Tianamen Square too busy with the Olympics to be the site of another Goddess of Democracy statue.

I suppose many comments will follow saying that I don't know what I'm talking about, so let me pre-emp. I am Taiwanese. I know my fair share of REAL Chinese history, and I would like to thank Bill for bringing up Taiwan during this current period of anti-Chinese sentiment.

Anonymous said...

One of the biggest challenges facing China is language reform. The May 4th Movement in 1919 saw the overthrow of classical Chinese written discourse and replaced it with baihua (plain language). New punctuation was introduced like "" ; ? ! ..

Hu Shi, Lu Xun and others rejected cliched writing over sentences with grammar rules. Baihua was replaced with putonghua in China after the Commuist Party won the civil war. But long do you think it takes to get a billion people (many formerly slaves) to be literate? Let alone learn how to write reasoned arguments logically.

The 6 year-old comments from the pro-China government supporters here reflect the long way that language reform still has to go. Some people just do not understand what equivocation is.

Furthermore, the word for logic (louji) did not enter the Chinese language until the May 4th Movement in 1919. So, one can understand how it is that some are just unable to recognize equivocation.

Anonymous said...

The Olympics have become swill for the Pigs at the trough. It is time to cancell all Olympics and start again with true amature contests. This gorging at the trough has to stop. Have the Olympics declared what they are Subsidies for the businesses and a drain on the poor.A set of games for the pros with no public money involved. Amature games spread out through the world where the venues already exist.

Anonymous said...

Hi Bill, I have to say that you know little about Chinese history and your idea is so naive.

Anonymous said...

All this protesting and boycotting Olympics is the latest trendy thing to do, now that Iraq and the Muslim "enemies" are quiet for the moment.

If it happened anywhere else and not in China, where citizens of a country stabbed and burned other citizens to death, looted and pillaged, it would be condemned. But when the police intervened in China it was "oppression".

The Western media is also extremely biased. In London and Paris there were only reports of the protesters, but not a single article on the supporters there who outnumbered the protesters - support and happiness don't make sensational news as riots.

The Olympics is something the whole of China and Chinese people around the world was looking forward to, to open up the country for friendship. To show the West how far China has come since the Dynasty and Communist eras; for anyone who has any knowledge of what's actually happening in the country, they would know China is more Capitalist today than Communist.

To turn China away from the world by bycotting and ruining the Games, which are suppose to unit despite strife and differences, will do nothing to help the Tibetans or any of the human rights issues.

Anonymous said...

I do agree with anonymous that your idea is naive. Bill, as a canadian, you don't and never will understand the real situation of the country that has more than 13 billion people and more than 5000 years of history. i read your artical on the 24 hours and feel funny how you said " boycott china" you are too emotional and brain-washed by the false media reporting. you don't know the real situation on what is really happening back in tibet. chinese government is stupid for closing all the information from outsiders and blocking all the websites, it is also become a reason for people like you to image and say whatever you think it is that is very inresponsiable!!!!

Anonymous said...

whoever wrote this artical, you are so stupid!

DL said...

I would hate to try to put words in Bill's mouth so won't.

Of course it's not the average Chinese person the article is all about. It's the government. Same one that holds a large majority of the U.S debt. Yet today the White House is musing about George Bush not attending the grand very expensive, start up and the IOC are talking about cancelling the grand torch tour. My God, even Harper has said he isn't going and I do believe the Frence President is of the same opinion. Oh we do like the cheap Tshirts and electronics and sort of forget the workers get peanuts. We forget that China kicked a lot of people out of the way when they built the 3 Gorge dam. Some of the anons seem of the opion that they are right and the rest of us are wrong. VANOC is quaking in their expensive shoes because a boycott in China might affect the local big show
I have not spent time in China, my wife did a few trips there and they visited the poor regions. Women walking groups tend to go places with the interests of the locals in mind.
The smog is awful, it's ofen hard to breath, but the locals treated them like friends. It's hardly ever the locals, it's those guys in the strange suits that run things. If the locals don't like it they take their lives in their hands by showing the world, they don't like what's going on. Nobody really nows how many were killed in Tinnamen Square. But some folks here simply figure things are just great there, mind you none have to live under conditions that such a regime controls. We like to watch sports but it's not likely we will be doing anything in support of th Chinese Olympics.

大龙 said...

Dear Bill,

After reading your master " Let's boycott China altogether", I wanna share some thoughts from a real Chinese with you.

I am an immigrant from China. Canada is my second home country. I love Canada and would like to die for Canada. Actually, many Chinese people have been generating value and wealth for Canada since centuries ago.

But, I am still and forever a Chinese whatever my citizenship. As most Chinese people living in China or abroad do, I love China but Chinese government. We love China because of its glory history, magnificent culture, and kind, peaceful, and diligent people.

However, most of us are not satisfied with the current government, demanding freedom, democracy, and prosperity. Chinese people suffered since 200 years ago when Britain and France started to invade China. Chinese people deserve better lives, deserve freedom, democracy and prosperity, which neither Britain and France nor current government can give us.

Now you understand real Chinese's thoughts, we do not like the current government, we either do not like any groups or individuals who want to hamper China's development in economy or democracy.

You can say I hate government, which maybe bring you credits. But never say boycott China! By that, you are boycotting China's long history, you are boycotting China's fruitful culture, and you are boycotting all Chinese people.

Next, I will discuss some specific issues with you.

As for Olympics, if you ask common people in China, I guess more than half of them do not like Olympics, which grabs us too much money and lands. But reject to Olympics does not mean reject to China.

As for Tibet, Tibetian people just demand freedom rather than independence. Even Tibet leaders claimed Tibet is part of China, how can you claim Tibet a country in your article? If you do not learn China and Tibet's history and current situation, please do not make a wrong decision for Tibetian people.

As for Taiwan, even the new elected president claimed there is only one China either PRC or ROC, how can you claim Taiwan a country in your article? Same here, if you do not learn China and Taiwan's history and current situation, please do not make a wrong decision for Chinese people.

As for Goods made in China, to be honest, most common Chinese people wish foreign people never buy things made in China. Export to foreign counties and outsourcing bring China nothing but child labours, heavy pollutions, government corruption, and a huge waste of precious land, which is the living basis of many generations.

Stop here, if you have more discussion, please feel free to contact me by wslongcn@yahoo.com.cn

Thanks,

David Wu

大龙 said...

Dear Bill,

After reading your master " Let's boycott China altogether", I wanna share some thoughts from a real Chinese with you.

I am an immigrant from China. Canada is my second home country. I love Canada and would like to die for Canada. Actually, many Chinese people have been generating value and wealth for Canada since centuries ago.

But, I am still and forever a Chinese whatever my citizenship. As most Chinese people living in China or abroad do, I love China but Chinese government. We love China because of its glory history, magnificent culture, and kind, peaceful, and diligent people.

However, most of us are not satisfied with the current government, demanding freedom, democracy, and prosperity. Chinese people suffered since 200 years ago when Britain and France started to invade China. Chinese people deserve better lives, deserve freedom, democracy and prosperity, which neither Britain and France nor current government can give us.

Now you understand real Chinese's thoughts, we do not like the current government, we either do not like any groups or individuals who want to hamper China's development in economy or democracy.

You can say I hate government, which maybe bring you credits. But never say boycott China! By that, you are boycotting China's long history, you are boycotting China's fruitful culture, and you are boycotting all Chinese people.

Next, I will discuss some specific issues with you.

As for Olympics, if you ask common people in China, I guess more than half of them do not like Olympics, which grabs us too much money and lands. But reject to Olympics does not mean reject to China.

As for Tibet, Tibetian people just demand freedom rather than independence. Even Tibet leaders claimed Tibet is part of China, how can you claim Tibet a country in your article? If you do not learn China and Tibet's history and current situation, please do not make a wrong decision for Tibetian people.

As for Taiwan, even the new elected president claimed there is only one China either PRC or ROC, how can you claim Taiwan a country in your article? Same here, if you do not learn China and Taiwan's history and current situation, please do not make a wrong decision for Chinese people.

As for Goods made in China, to be honest, most common Chinese people wish foreign people never buy things made in China. Export to foreign counties and outsourcing bring China nothing but child labours, heavy pollutions, government corruption, and a huge waste of precious land, which is the living basis of many generations.

Stop here, if you have more discussion, please feel free to contact me by this email.

Thanks,

David Wu

Budd Campbell said...

You're aroused my curiousity, Bill.

I wonder if you're recommending a complete trade boycott against China similar to the old US boycott, or to the boycott the Americans still apply to Cuba?

If so, I think a lot more than just poor quality toys may be affected.

Franklin Liao said...

Meist Mordarto's points are valid. There is no right for Tibet to separate within the legal instruments of the PRC constitution.

I disagree about Li Hou's comments, for PRC wouldn't dare compare its current regime to that of its predecessors such as the Manchurian Qing regime (whom would have been the only one in that 200 year time-frame to have any say on Tibetan affairs), while warlords and Nationalists post 1911 to 1949 had no real say on Tibet. I seriously doubt that the PRC would like to be equated to the aforementioned parties. (Last I checked, PRC rather not mention about the provisional Nanking government of the ROC, the warlords and would instead 'skip a few pages to 1949' when Chiang got chased out of China.)

Chinese track records regarding manufactured goods unfortunately is no simple matter. Some part of the issue also stems from the western world entrepreneurs looking to cut costs at any mean. It should be addressed separately from the Tibetan issue.

Anonymous said...

You're just copying what other's told you. You have no brain because a person with a brain should hear two sides of the story, or do his/her best to see something in person, or to verify it. Maybe it is better to say your have half brain and is half-blind and half-deaf. You may find the my language insulting. But remember a bitter pill helps to cure your illness. Hope you make no more assertions. Sadly, your thoughts are "bought" by the newspaper editors, heavily polluting the air of our lovely Canada!

Anonymous said...

Jeez Bill you sure hit a nerve with this one. That'll teach ya'. Although it is a pretty interesting reaction to see and learn from. Now I know why the city rags keep a tight lid on this stuff. I've been shaking my head since the Beijing Olympics were awarded though, so go figure?

Someone further up the post pole said scrap it and given that it is becoming cast as a a poli-corporati-maffiaso trough, or something like that, why not? Or at least return it to the amateurs and put 'Dick' Pound at the helm (Imagine the sound bites).

Anyway the long and short of it is China didn't and still doesn't deserve the Olympics Games in my opinion. The Olympics and the ideals they are supposed to uphold are not best exemplified in China in my opinion. If you can't make the litmus test tough tootie!

Greg said...

United States of China? United States of America? Please don't leave out the USA, you'd risk looking racist. Cretin.

Lindy19 said...

Please, not another misinformed China-bashing. You say we should boycott China altogether. I've never heard such stupid advice.

Most Chinese-Canadians wouldn't support economic and/or political isolation of China. Even if they do, that'd be suicide as far as Canada's international status is concerned. We would be the ones isolated on the world stage--no self-interested country would follow our suit and give up business with the biggest market in the world.

Then we'd have no diplomatic or economic leverage to push China to change its minority policy, and that'd be hurting, not helping, the Tibetan cause. Let's have some reasonable opinions, not misdirected polemic.

Boycotting China won't make the situation better - that's just an irresponsible response, trying to ignore the problem instead of engaging it and coming to a solution. In the end, the oppressed minorities wouldn't be helped; only your moral indignation would be appeased by this ridiculous rant and even more ridiculous proposal.

Mr. Harper would do better to try and understand and work with the Chinese government rather than publicly embarrassing it, which is just a way to get votes. Unless the entire world is willing to oppose China together (which they aren't), one country's unwise remarks would just make matters worse, ruining its chances of meaningful dialogue with China to effect change.

It's common sense that people listen if they trust you; how can you expect China to listen to what we have to say when all we do is bully and bash them every chance we get?

I'm not supporting every CCP directive, hardly. But really, this should be about doing what's right for the people of both countries, not for satisfying our own "moral superiority."

How many Chinese workers, who are barely making it as it is, would be affected if China loses Canada as one of its export markets? How can you justify hurting one group of people to avenge another...even though you really won't be helping either?

Just to let you know, "Lu" is Lu Shimin's last name, not "Shimin." If you did any research in Chinese culture or the country, you would know that last names come first in Chinese names. And as for the labelling of "vicious" to the Chinese government - please do not generalize and essentialize - the CCP is not the Nazi party reincarnated.

Anonymous said...

Nothing changes . . . Hitler and the Berlin Olympics in 1936 and Canada's Mackenzie-King was ready to B.J. his "friend" Adolf.

In 2008 Canada's business and beautiful elite are ready to put their knee-pads on for the Chinese People's Liberation Army's investment capital.

The Chinese government imprisons millions and excutes thousands but "we" line up for their blood money.

We are as bad as them . . .

The GREAT SATAN

Anonymous said...

Although I think it is a waste of my time to educate ignorant and biased westerners like you, but I also feel it is necessary to do so because people have the right to know the truth. First of all, Tibet has been a part of China since Yuan Dynasty, which goes back to almost 1000 years ago. To say Tibet is a country just shows your ignorance about Chinese history. Secondly, some biased people keep mixing sports with politics. Olympics is a sporting event, a special occasion to bring people of all races and nationalities together. It should not involve politics. Thirdly, to say that China's exports mainly consist of lead toys and contaminated foods again shows your bias and ignorance. Take a look at yourself or around your house. You are surrounded by "Made in China" products and you are able to enjoy your daily life with these products. You won't even have clothes to wear, TV to watch, laptop to use if you boycott "Made in China" products.

Anonymous said...

Hi Bill,
The suggestion of launching a complete boycott Chinese made products was merely absurd and amature as China is emerging as the second largest trading partner Canada has (US being largest).
I do not believe that you are in a position to comment on the Tibet issue if you aren't able to digest information from both sides. Clearly, the Tibet issue was triggered by a riot rather than protest. It was a planned incident as well, if not by Dalai, then by other outside forces. Though Dalai has presented himself towards the western media as a peaceful figure, the hidden side may not be as pleasant as you'd imagine. There is no talk between Dalai Lama and the Chiense government right now, and China shouldn't take the full blame. Dalai Lama's stance towards the China-Tibet issue has shifted numerous times in the past few decades and apparently no one sees that. Also, Dalai's proposed ideas of a self-governed territory is unrealistic and self-contradicting. Though he declared that he was against Tibet independence, his proposal of bargaining says otherwise.

Dalai's opening bargains include: expanding the Tibetan region to 1/4 of the entire Chinese domain, removal of populations of all other ethnicities in the area, and complete removal of Chinese military forces facilities in the area. If you were in the shoes of the Chinese government, would you choose to talk to Dalai to make a fool out of yourself?

Bill Tieleman said...

I will respond Wednesday to the many postings from Tuesday in response to my column on China and the Olympics.

Anonymous said...

Wow how ignorant can you get? Do you even know anything about China? All you see is the biased western media. Do you know the history of tibet? Do you know the history of the Dalai Lamas? Please, do us all a favour and shut up. Go to tibet, go to China and see whats really going on. Open up your eyes, maybe that will help you get outside of your box.

JayC said...

Sorry Bill... I enjoy listening to you on CKNW in the mornings with Bill Good, but please stick to topics that cover issues here in British Columbia because you have no idea about the relationship between Canada and China nor do you have clue about Tibet's history with China.

Anonymous said...

what do you know about Tibet and China? What do you know about Taiwan and China?
And how much do you know about that poisonous toys issue??
After all the media buzz about this issu,the factory chief committed suicide in his own plant !!!
And few days later, the US toy company, apologised to China, because they found that the problem was not come from the making, but the conception of the toy!!
Because of all those prejudices about "made in china", and stupid people like you, made a man death!!
How stupid are you!

neo said...

Bill Tieleman,

You make me laugh, go ahead, boycott China altogether, just do it, but first, check that computer you are using, make sure it has nothing made in China. oh yeah, I mean it, break down with your dirty hand, and check very parts in your computer, if you find anything made in China there, Please Please, throw it away and get one made in Canada, I guess that will tough.. LOL..

you piece of laughing stick..

Alex G Tsakumis said...

Bill:

Best column you've ever written. I feel so very proud to be your colleague.

My maternal grandfathers relatives escaped the Nazis, and the struggle of other family members has left an indelible impression on my mother, who was a young girl at the time, so much so that you could not maintain dry eyes listening to the stories. .

How many young Tiberan girls will know the same lasting images of such savagery?

The bastard communist Chinese should be sanctioned as severely as possible for the genocide they commit in Tibet.

I have traveled throughout Asia. If the honourable citizens of China knew of this atrocity, you would see revolts that the hardliners would not be able to suppress.

Damn them and their disgraceful existence.

You make us proud Bill.

Best,

AGT

Anonymous said...

Hi Bill,
If you insist that Tibet is a country and has been invaded by China, I will say the history of Chinese invasion in Tibet is much longer than European invasion in North America and Australia. Even years ago, the Native people didn't have citizenship in Australia. If you still insist China should give up Tibet, you'd better pack your own stuff, get out of Canada and go back to your European hometown!

大龙 said...

Hi, Bill

Following the last letter, I am writing to ask all foreigners (including Chinese-Canadian) never buy goods made in China, in an attempt to save child labours, polluted environment, corrupted governments, and countless migrate workers, especially, save our precious resources and lands.

Thanks you all foreigners who boycott Goods made in China.

Anonymous said...

2010 OLYMPIC GAMES ??? MAKES CANADA A COUNTRY OF FORCED LABOUR! Before anyone throws stones at China, take a look at all the Cdn. scandals that get white washed! Is Stephan Harper a hypocrite or what. Where there is wrong-doing/CRIME, There are victims.... WHERE ARE THE VICTIMS? Lost, and hidden behind another falsified identity!

DL said...

It seems the biggest supporters of China admit to the harsh and often death of anyone who stands up and says" Hey just a minute here folks this is our country too."

The hard thing to understand is just because China is now a powerhouse buying and selling, with total disregard to the rights of it's citizens, Canada's companies can prosper from dealing with that gang of thugs, we are all supposed to tody right up to that countries government.Let's all pretend all is well and support some sports event. So it seems that if money is involved citizen rights mean nothing. Cross the goons and get beaten or worse.To add insult to lives of the folks in some religious group, their major body organs are taken and sold. Hey China is moving right along with a buck to be made.

Similar comment coming out of Ottawa pretty well agree with what Tieleman has said. If we , for FREE, experts rattle on about the guy doing this column, it's rather unlikely we have all that much knowledge of what the hell is going on. My God, they even shut down a CBC prorgam that had been invited to observe. Harper is right and I applaud him for saying sorry I can't make it. Mind you he might change his mind. Maybe he sees more poorly inspected products as a necessity for us folk

Gordo of course will try to be front and center hogging some camera time. Hope they don't dont do the ice fishing routine again so the world can see how dumb we all are.

Our citizens have fought for years to keep the right of open comment, something that sure as hell doesn't happen in China. If it's really all about trade, why call it a sporting event? For the ones who figure China is doing great, maybe i'ts time to give your heads a shake.

Denis Love.

North Van's Grumps said...

Boycott Made in China products, eh!

Here's one short list of products made in China seven pages long. From "MP3 Player" to "Mosquito Killer bat".

At the rate the world is consuming petroleum based products, it won't be long before we're almost back to the horse and buggy per family (mountain bikes YES; we may though end up going to bed when the sun sets; to be up early to milk the goat;

Anonymous said...

Boycott Chinese goods? "Da Long" you're a total bafoon. I'd like to see you even attempt to survive a day without buying something made in China. You think boycotting will be effective. Pah! Let me tell you what your idiotic ideas will result in - mass famine, worse suffering, and lower socio-economic status. People will die of low wages and unemployment because of total bigots like who think that boycotting can all of a sudden make a government democratic.

And why why do have to pick on Chinese Canadians? What've we done to you? Just cause we're racially Chinese doesn't make us any less Canadian than you white folks! Geez total idiot!

Anonymous said...

Bill, did you investigate before you make this kind of article? I believe you didn't do any investigation. I will tell you Tibet was, is, and will be part of China forever!!! We Chinese will hold the best Olympic Games in 2008. And I also want to tell you that don't only concern about the money someone give you and sell your conscience. Think about the issues thoroghly and then make your decision. Even though I know that my words don't change your mind, I would like to tell you that you are such stupid gang and racist in Vancouver.

Anonymous said...

Dear friends,



I don’t want to bother you too much. I don’t want to talk with you something concerned about political issues. But when the situation got worse and worse, when many of my friends ask me for things about Tibet, Tibetan, and Beijing Olympic games in 2008, I know it’s time that I have to say something to debate lots of rumors and lies.

Before you read and watch the following information. I would like to say to everyone who wants to get the real information about Tibet Issue:

DO INVESTIGATING BY YOURSELF OWN AND THEN MAKE DECISION WHAT IS YOUR OPINNION. IF YOU WANT TO FIND THE TRUTH, IT’S BETTER TO GO OUR COUNTRY AND SEE WHAT WAS HAPPEN IN CHINA!

We Chinese people love peace as well as the people in other countries. Only few terrorists want to make the world into the troubles. We should unite as one to blame and fight with the terrorists.

ONE WORLD, ONE DREAM.

Wish every country has peace situation forever!!!



Yes, we wish!





John (Jiang Zhili)



1. Before you make some decision about the Tibet Issues, I strongly suggest that you need learn some Tibetan history from the bellowing.



In response to Bill Tieleman's campaign of boycotting China(http://vancouver.24hrs.ca/Columnists/NewsViewsAttitude/ ),

and M. Graham's comment "Does China have any supporters that are NOT Chinese or from

China?" I suggest you check out this video made by a non-Chinese scholar and documentary

producer found on

Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xsoc4-QnplY&feature=RecentlyWatched&page=1&t=t&f=b

This will at least help people to understand the situation a little better. It is always easy to point at China from an outsider's position what we do wrong, despite all the good we've done for 1.3 billion people on earth.



2. The truth about the riots in Tibet!!!

You guys can see lots of truth that the so called “ protest” just do harm to the citizens even to Tibetan in Tibet Autonomous Region, China!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ic8FFMVN7yI (in English)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrTwvzNsIYg&feature=related (in English)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pJeKsN5S1c&feature=related (in English)



The following news were reported by the Phoenix TV, but unfortunately, I could not find English version.

文涛拍案2008年03月30日:西藏拉萨骚乱亲历记A http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk-oWVXbtxA

文涛拍案2008年03月30日:西藏拉萨骚乱亲历记B http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5CdrQj36ls

文涛拍案2008年03月30日:西藏拉萨骚乱亲历记C http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHwWF2NbfDk

文涛拍案2008年03月30日:西藏拉萨骚乱亲历记D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVoyTn7Ej-0



3. Distorted news by the western media

Here is an English version of evidence of how the western media reports with false footage and misleading information. Now if you watch the news on the media, you might find those false reports yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsACG7NYmlQ&feature=related



CNN, one of the biggest news source in the US, when reporting Tibet riot / turmoil, they are intentionally painting a anti-Chinese Gov. picture! The footage they show, those troops are clearly NOT Chinese!! That's such an insult! Where is their professionalism?? Why are they intentionally release false report? That's such a scandal in the journalism field in the western society!



This footage is the actual report from CNN:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpAA1WGgUyg&feature=related



4. Free Tibet, wait, where is Tibet?

Ok! That is how to believe that stupid persons who have no idea where is Tibet protest China??? This video told us a litter bit truth that "The more you lie, the more money you earn"!!! That's the truth for the separatists. They are only aiming for money! Not for "freedom". No wonder why western people supporting separatists. They get paid by doing the stupid protesting.



Enjoy those such people!!! Like animals in the Zoo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twHzXN3kNTs&eurl=h



5.citynews vote : Should Canada boycott the Olympic Openning Ceremonies in Beijing?

http://www.citynews.ca/polls.aspx?pollid=3691

Anonymous said...

Bill, your credibility has gone out the window with this one simple clue: you don't even know what Lu Shumin's surname is. It's Lu, not Shumin.
Anyone who claims to be educated and worldly, and living in Vancouver, ought to know that Chinese surnames are listed first.

Anonymous said...

You are totally a coward!!! You have no guts to see what is true (you are not dare to go to China where 1.3billion people thriving). You dare not to publish those comments. You are totally a sucker!

juner said...

I have been asked by BC Mary to perhaps post a blog here on Bill's site because of his article on China.
To begin with, my eldest son lives and works in Shanghai. He asked his ole mom to come across to him and to travel with him to some places he has been before in China. I had 6 weeks with him and I can truly say...it was a journey and not a trip!
There were many, many times during my visits to the "big cities" and the very small mountain villages and in my discussions with several young people who lived,went to university and work there that my heart was VERY sore.
My first place to visit was Beijing and Tianemen Square. I stood where the tank had stood and walked where thousands of students had walked and where many hundreds of them had been "massacared" by their own government.
My discussions with the few who can speak and understand any small amount of English told me this;
The government of China is so powerful that they hold 1.3 billion people under control. How do they do that? They allow absolutely no freedom of press or of news reporting, so most people, unless they are one of the 300 million who have been given the opportunity to move ahead, know absolutely nothing about what goes on in their own country never mind outside in the rest of the world.
Their education system is deeply flawed and teachers are paid on average 3,000 RMB per month. That translates my friends, to approximately 360.00 per month.Many go to sub-par universities to enable them to teach to only find themselves stuck in their own villages with these kind of wages and with little or no opportunity to move elsewhere.
The justice system itself is non-existant as the government also controls any verdicts that judges give out. There is no verdict given without government deciding or changing it.
The 800 million who are considerd peasants (farmers), the poor and the very poor,are not ALLOWED to own their own property, yet the 300 million who live in the Big Cities can now own their own property. However,prices are so astronomical, that most, other than the extremely rich, will ever own anything of their own.Many of the 800 million are not able to read or write. It is, therefore very easy to control for a government like that in China. You see, the 300 million will never squeek about the government control, because THEY know, what they have can be taken away with the snap of a finger and in a flash. The 800 million are oft times unknowing and are too busy just trying to put food in their families mouths and clothes on their backs!
In the villages and smaller towns, there is no electricity, there is no running water and the people live, for the most part in brick adobe very small homes. Oft times, there are no schools, so children have no education.
My point with this is that the government of China and the manner they treat their own people is just so unacceptable I can hardly speak! There was the "Great Leap Forward" where government policy killed 30 million people through famine. There was the "Cultural Revolution"...another government policy, that killed millions more and destroyed much of the countries history and banned those with brain power out into the rural areas to farm and clear land and to torture and terrorize them.
Add to the unsound education system and the non-existant judicial system there are also no health and safety rules that are enforced, there are no pensions and health care is at a minimum.
My heart cries for the Chinese people. They have suffered immensley by a government that is so tight fisted it would make your head swim!
If I thought any kind of boycott would topple the government and provide the people of that immense country with choices, I would be in favour of any kind of boycott. If I thought that to NOT boycott would ensure the people would get back what in fact we pay for their goods, I would not boycott. The reality my friends is that the people get back nothing!
Two awesome books, which my son had me read before going on this journey, are "Wild Swans; Three Daughters of China" by Juang Chang and "Riversong, Two Years on the Yangtze" by Peter Hessler.Once you read these will you truly understand what I saw and what I am saying here.
Thank you Bill for taking up this topic and for those who negatively comment in and unsound manner, I say, shame on you!

Anonymous said...

"1.3 billion thriving"????? Anonymous 10:54 PM

Well maybe the 130 million working in sweatshops like the one documented in "China Blue" (Walmart denim from birth to North American sales) are surviving, but thriving? I don't think so.

1,321,851,888 China's population
minus 130,000,000 "China Blues'" equals 1,191,851,888


1,191,851,888 minus 2,300,000
armed forces equals 1,189,551,888

1,189,551,888 minus 800,000,000 farmers equals 389,551,888

The balance are pregnant women.

Anonymous said...

Hey, Bill,
It is easy for you to say boycott China... surely your sumptous salary can afford it. But I am just a poor guy, I cannot afford expensive goods and food for my livelihood. I need those damn cheap Chinese products for my survival, and do not have the luxury for empty talk. So please don't do any thing to jeopardise my survival right. I know I will have PEACE if you deign to show your COMPASSION.

Anonymous said...

Bill:

I am just wondering how much truth you really know about the recent event in Tibet or the historic background of Taiwan, or the real essence of DaiLai Lama or anything about China that qualifies you to make any judgment.

If you advocate for the support of Taiwan, why don't you do the same for Quebec? Would you think you would still have a job in BC? Perhaps in Quebec you would.

Did the Chinese armed police(rather than the military) go into Tibet for no reason or was it because there were organized riots targeted for the disruption of the Olympics?

Just how much do you know about Dailai? Is he the truth Saint that the West has described all these years? If so, why would the West do that?

Perhaps if you use your thinking a bit more rather than your confrontation remarks, you would become a more non-judgemental person.

If Canada's human rights is so near perfect, where is the human rights for that Romanian immigrant that got killed by the police at the Vancouver airport?

Think and investigate before you comment on anything. That would be my career advice to you.

Anonymous said...

Hey Bill, As a Canadian I found your comments about China one sided and very offensive and disturbing. In my opinion, It does not help nor encourage the unity of this country as well as diplomatic relations with China.
I always thought Canada was supposed to be country of tolerance, mutual respect and understanding. such comments like racism are faux pas, unacceptable and no place in Canadian society, (even if its a democracy) and values. If not, then What is the meaning of multiculturalism? when the Prime Minister wants to propose legislation to shut it doors on immigration.

Bill Tieleman said...

To Anonymous 2:26 p.m - I believe Quebec has the democratic right to self-determination, including separation if a majority support that in a fair vote.

The Dalai Lama was recognized by the Nobel Peace Prize committee and has world-wide support. The Chinese government, which shares your views or worse on the Dalai Lama, has an oppressive record of violating human rights.

Which source is more credible?

I oppose the use of violence, period. I do not support violence against Chinese people in Tibet or anywhere.

I have written a lot about the outrageous treatment of the Polish immigrant who died at Vancouver Airport, Robert Dziekanski - search this blog and you can read it.

But there are real differences between tragic individual cases of police action and systemic repression, unfair imprisonment and torture.

Lastly, I am open to new information always - but repeating Chinese government propaganda isn't new.

Anonymous said...

"Which source is more credible?"
Bill, you have point out exactly the problem. A westerner in his right senses will immediately give credibility to the Delei Lamo the Nobel Peace Prize laureate, regardless of solid facts which are crystal clear to Chinese people. That is exactly why oversea Chinese are indignant when western media portraited that the riot in Tibet is a peaceful demonstration, and controlling this riot is a ruthless crackdown. Chinese people are not as dumb as you would believe. See how they react to the 6.4 crack down of 1989 and the event this time. If boycotting of China threatens my right to survival due to lost of cheap goods, shall we hold a rally at your office or residence ? If it is as peaceful as the one taken place at Tibet, are you happy about that?

....TNND2008EPAF

Anonymous said...

A few things to say, Mr. Bill Tieleman:

1. You have never been to China, nor XiZang(or the stupid English Colonial name Tibet) and you have never read any books about XiZang or China. If so, you don't have the right to talking about either Tibet or China. If you did no work on these issues but insisted talking about them, you are fooling your readers and yourself!

Or otherwise, you pretend you did not see or hear anything happened in London, Paris or San Francisco in the torch relay! In one word, you behaved stupid!

2. Go ahead with your stupid boycotting China suggestion. Let's see who will be the loser!Also let's see if the Canadian government will listen to you!

3. I don't know what do you mean by human rights? Did you think of human rights when your ancestors or the pioneer settlers killed the aboriginals after they landed on THEIR land?

How do you think of human rights in your so-called Tibet when Dalai Lama and his ruling class scalped, severed, and beheaded their slaves, the majority of Tibetans when he ruled Tibet? Dalai and his ruling class lost their slave-owners’ privilege to depriving another person’s part of body or whole life so that’s what you meant the violations of Dalai’s human rights?!

4. You are brain-washed and used by some treacherous people for sure.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 7:12pm

Haha, your comments demonstrate your ignorance and lack of knowledge.

Have you been to Bod (བོད་) (the Tibetan name for Tibet)?

Try to calm down a little.

Anonymous said...

You're all over the map here Bill, just come right out and say it.

K. Chen said...

First I’m Chinese and lived in overseas long enough to feel the freedom and democracy of human race. China is too far behind.
I love my country China, but I have to differentiate China and Chinese Communist Government – it is an evil party.
Those idiots who said: “Hey Bill, you don’t know anything about China…etc...” I say they are just a bunch of Red army retards, may be they ‘re black hand secret police and spies, because they were all educated by a set of “fact-twisted” history books published under the communist regime. And shame on them while they live and breathe in a free society. Abundant of books and information are more than enough for a foreigner to understand China better than a Chinese. What they were told by their party to undermine the freedom of speech in this society to cover their crime, oppression, human right abuses, and worst of all, they’re destroying the Traditional Chinese Culture, and become heartless people.
You are a brave man Bill! Please keep up the justice and your good work. All the good people will support you always!
No matter how many of those idiots try to negate and twist the facts, China, very soon, will have to follow the wheel of human race and change into democracy. That’s why those idiotic got crazy while they are being eliminated by history.

Anonymous said...

Hey Honorable K. Chen,
You may be one of those elite few who would be the future Messiah for China - congratulations! .. but there are enough self-appointed messiahs in Canada alone. Knowing China from books doesn't equate automatically to knowing the mindset of Chinese people. The Communist government is certainly very bad 20 or 30 years ago, and is not good enough today either. Despite one can pin-point a thousand accusations to the Chinese government, one single factor alone will be sufficient to bring the majority of Chinese people (not including you yourself, because you are from the world of the elite few)to support their government. Guess what? Are they brain-washed?
Are they idiots? Your call. Tibet is not Kosovo, neither is China Yugoslavia. It would be naive to the extreme to believe there is right or wrong in international politics. See how double standard is applied liberally by all the nations to advance their agenda. Wake up, man.
....TNND2008EPAF

Anonymous said...

hi, bill
let me present my views a several short setences.
firstly, i dont know how much u learn on the chinese history, but i dont think u have a deep research about that, especially the problem of taiwan.
secondly, i hope ur opinions are full of anger, but not rational at all. u just give off your emotion, but not the truth of the event. we are all naive about the political problems since we have no a clear idea on the truth.
why not calm down and talk about it peacefully

Anonymous said...

Hi, have you ever been to china? how much do you really know china?
you can boycott china?we dont care , any government have problem, but the good news is chinese government is no the right way , as a commom chinese, we would like to give them . the western democracy is not suitable to china.