tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post994043955603821380..comments2023-07-25T02:39:44.615-07:00Comments on Bill Tieleman: BC Government Bailouts for BC Film Industry? Cut! The Never Ending Call For More Money From HollywoodBill Tielemanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03304971610140279157noreply@blogger.comBlogger41125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-1388191401014107842013-02-02T18:48:38.713-08:002013-02-02T18:48:38.713-08:00Regardless of whether it's called a subsidy, a...Regardless of whether it's called a subsidy, a credit or an incentive, it means that one sector of the economy is receiving favoured treatment by not having to pay as much to do business here as any other sector. The arguments advanced in favour of the film industry could equally be made of any other one: "[insert preferred recipient of subsidy/credit/incentive here - eg, forestry, teachers, airlines, restaurants, etc] hire(s) lots of local people, who pay taxes and contribute to their community. If they don't get this subsidy, they'll stop working and the province won't get any income tax from them." Of course any business will increase if their costs drop. The key question is why we prefer to encourage the film industry to any other. If the film industry doesn't like our wage structure, our workers will seek other alternatives. It's not film or nothing, it's film or each person's next best choice. If film leaves, maybe people will start making more furniture, making more artwork, doing more farming, writing more software, doing more banking - whatever. Whatever they choose to do, they will then pay income tax on their earnings and the companies that hire them will pay regular corporate tax. I don't see any need to favour film over anything else - people in BC have all the options in the world of what kinds of jobs to pursue.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-891194136924769402013-01-29T10:01:13.868-08:002013-01-29T10:01:13.868-08:00organized crime is why missing women went on for s...organized crime is why missing women went on for so long<br />Piggy Palace.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-6880815636861552092013-01-28T17:59:55.548-08:002013-01-28T17:59:55.548-08:00Bill, I think you posted an old Globe link in your...Bill, I think you posted an old Globe link in your article. A more recent article is at <br /><br />http://www.theglobeandmail.com/arts/film/the-fight-to-salvage-bcs-film-industry/article7555156/<br /><br />I posted a comment on that article at the globe site and as usual received no answer to a couple of my questions included in the comment. One of them was a request for Ms. Lederman to confirm a source for a side comment about the HST, a subject that is, of course, dear to Bill's heart. No reply to date.<br /><br />I wish that there was more of a debate about the quality of the art that is produced by various support programs (tax breaks, grants, CBC) rather than simply economics. You have some pretty good film makers in BC (Carl Besai, Julia Kwan, Mina Shum, ex-Edmontonian Anne Wheeler come to mind as a start) but they seem to be either not working or pumping out forgettable TV episodes.<br />PeterInEdmontonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-11890795324190136612013-01-28T13:21:41.529-08:002013-01-28T13:21:41.529-08:00All these tax subsidies result in less money comin...All these tax subsidies result in less money coming into the provincial coffers. It contriubtes to the high deficiet B.C. has. The question becomes, is it more important to give tax credits to foreign corporations or tax them and keep the deficient lower. When the government runs out of money they cut health care, education, etc. So is the tax break to the film industry or any industry worth it. <br /><br />What are the societal repercussions of another couple of thousand unemployed in B.C. Do the taxes they pay make up for the susidies the film companies receive. A cost anaylisis might be in order here.<br /><br />I am tired of seeing foreign corporations and Canadian corporations getting huge tax execptios, subsidies, etc. while we the wage earner don't receive much of a break at all. We have less money coming into the provincial coffers while large profitable corporations get tax write offs. So who benefits most? Right now it looks like a big company and I have to make up the differance.<br /><br />It is about time governments stopped with the corporate welfare routine. In the end these multinational corporations leave town anyhow. Corporations are global and they take their money where ever they think they can make the most. There is no need to impoverish the children of B.C. so some company can make more money.e.a.f.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-71928034485547199582013-01-27T19:34:00.156-08:002013-01-27T19:34:00.156-08:00Hello
First 150 million forestry giveaway and now ...Hello<br />First 150 million forestry giveaway and now this in 2013.?<br /><br />http://blogs.theprovince.com/2013/01/27/ben-parfitt-sneaky-liberals-are-planning-a-b-c-forest-giveaway/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-54445757211575589412013-01-27T19:33:28.589-08:002013-01-27T19:33:28.589-08:00Hello
First 150 million forestry giveaway and now ...Hello<br />First 150 million forestry giveaway and now this in 2013.?<br /><br />http://blogs.theprovince.com/2013/01/27/ben-parfitt-sneaky-liberals-are-planning-a-b-c-forest-giveaway/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-53615248961763242952013-01-25T23:07:03.929-08:002013-01-25T23:07:03.929-08:00Noteably missing is an accurate economic analysis ...Noteably missing is an accurate economic analysis of the costs and benefits of the various financing options.<br /><br />If the industry wants us to believe their concerns, then perhaps they can identify independent research that backs up their claims, not the wild guesses we have been hearing.morvenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07796315950096254135noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-1872939180811318682013-01-25T09:06:58.486-08:002013-01-25T09:06:58.486-08:00I do love, the Tyee (mostly Rafe Mair) and keep up...I do love, the Tyee (mostly Rafe Mair) and keep up the good work.<br /><br /> Confirmation bias, (remember Psych 101) seems to prevent people from understanding that film tax credits is not taxpayers money, it's a refund. The information is out there if you can but ideology aside and become fully versed. But that aside the workers at the firms below do not have a tax credit 'scheme':<br /><br />Panavision Canada Corporation,Cooperage Enterprises,A&DGripRentals,Rosewood Hotel Georgia,Mirrorball Productions Inc.,Black Tree Pictures,Bridge Studios,Front Porch Productions,Circle Productions,Clairmont Camera,Benevolent Crative Group,Fairmont Pacific Rim,Focus Entertainment Insurance Brokers Inc.,WFW International,Apparition Events & Media,Sugar Studios,HollyNorth Production Supplies,Meakes Illumination,Ponies and Rainbows,International Music Group Corp.,Going Viral Productions,Film Logic Customs Brokers Inc.,O’Connor Communications,Kodak Canada Inc,Nita Lake Lodge,Xquis Productions,Manifesto Films,Matrix Production Services,Morrisport Advanced Driving Inc, North Shore Studios, Opus Hotel,Pacific Backlot Services,Preferred Custom Brokers Inc.,Productions Service Inc.Shoot to Thrill,Loden Hotel,Roy’s Copier Service Ltd.,Scarab Digital,Sim Digital,ArisideEntertainment,Stagefab Custom Manufacturing,THEY Representation,Sutton Place Hotel,Technicolor Creative Services,The Burrard,The Capital Media Company,Vancouver Film Studios,Western One Rentals and Sales,Westin Grand Vancouver,The Prop Shop, Vancouver Prop,Acme Prop Shop, Thomas FX, Cananimportique,Filmgo Sales,Phoenix 1 Props,The Iron Works,Grantree Furniture Sales & Rental,Principals Talent,Moving Pictures,Talent,Lucas Talent,Carrier Talent,Kirk Talent Agencies,Kelly Services, Sales Talent Agency, Webster Talent Management,Trisko Talent Management Inc.,Mills Paint, Cloverdale Paint,Standard Building Supplies, Home Depot, Rona,Dick’s Lumber,Plastifab,Locations Catering,Truffles Catering, Tivoli Caterers, Sweetpea Caterers,Critic’s Choice Caterers,Serrano Catering,Reel West Productions,Stan’s Coffee Truck,Vango Mobile Espresso, The Bean Buggy Coffee Services,Classic Lighting,Torbram Electric Supply, Wesco Electric, Westburne Electric,Guillevan Electric Wholesale, KMS Tools,Parallel Locations Equipment Rentals, Cinequip White Sales, Best Film Services,Battery World,Polar Battery,All Axis Remote Camera Systems,Chapman Leonard Studio Equipment,Cine Audio Visual Ltd.,Eagle Camera Support Systems Ltd.,Finale Editworks, Emedia Digital Solutions, Epic Entertainment Corp,Juggarnaut Pictures Inc.,Paramount On Location,Telescopic Camera Crane Ltd.,Lee Filters Canada Inc.,Lorne Lapham Sales and Rentals Inc.,Emedia Pro Tape Sales,Matrix Pro Shop,Sim Video Productions Ltd.,VER Video Equipment RentalsTricitylights (closing business)http://www.tricitylights.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-25842863268745547652013-01-24T12:12:56.065-08:002013-01-24T12:12:56.065-08:00Bailing out private enterprise by governments is j...Bailing out private enterprise by governments is just plain wrong. That goes for all industries, including oil, gas, banks, everyone. Cherrypicking faltering businesses is not fair. All or none. I prefer none. Bailing out industries takes the "free" outof free enterprise and adds billions to our debtload. Anything else is "socialism"!!! <br />Now where did I hear that word before???Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-30719007254821135882013-01-24T07:02:51.197-08:002013-01-24T07:02:51.197-08:00Wonderin' if Michael Moore is considering a do...Wonderin' if Michael Moore is considering a documentary on the film industries tax credit schemes?<br />Working title: Flimflam Film.<br /><br />RSAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-91188144540461633552013-01-24T06:59:33.571-08:002013-01-24T06:59:33.571-08:00Wonderin' if Michael Moore is considering a do...Wonderin' if Michael Moore is considering a documentary on the film industry's tax credit schemes?<br />Working title: Flimflam Film.<br /><br />RS<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-2424754234805573402013-01-23T23:35:26.929-08:002013-01-23T23:35:26.929-08:00A tax credit may be a subsidy, but it does not ent...A tax credit may be a subsidy, but it does not entail taking money out of the provincial coffers. What it does mean is requiring less in taxes from the film industry. But this is more than offset by the taxable moneys spent in BC - for caterers (who will be taxed in BC) restaurants, hotels, income taxes, HST and on and on. It's extremely short sighted, no matter how much you rationalise it, to drive an industry that is worth so much in loonies and nickels out of the province and back to, say, Ontario or LA.<br /><br />Why do do you suppose those other jurisdictions are so willing to do what we are not? Because they know howvaluable it is to have films made there. It's not about overpaid movie stars; it's about adding value to a province known mostly for being a hewer of wood and a drawer of water.Penelope Personshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06568490631814894124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-34837555986044654612013-01-23T23:28:52.750-08:002013-01-23T23:28:52.750-08:00A tax credit does not mean paying taxpayers' m...A tax credit does not mean paying taxpayers' money to the film industry!!It simply means that the Filmmakers will pay less tax!!<br /><br />If they don't film here, they will pay NO tax, and the spin-offs from the business - like HST taxable moneys spent in BC - will never make it into our provincial kitty. Less money for caterers, restaurants, hotels, and on and on.... <br />Penelope Personshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06568490631814894124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-81787636592010626622013-01-23T22:44:57.999-08:002013-01-23T22:44:57.999-08:00One additional note: I was unaware when this colu...One additional note: I was unaware when this column was written of Premier Christy Clark's plan to spend a ridiculous $11 million on a one-time-only event for Bollywood awards in Vancouver - and I completely oppose it. <br /><br />Not only is it a crazy and crass waste of money right before an election but it is an insult at a time when the BC film industry needs thoughtful solutions. Bill Tielemanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03304971610140279157noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-79600643403196046352013-01-23T22:42:29.650-08:002013-01-23T22:42:29.650-08:00Thanks for the spirited debate here and on The Tye...Thanks for the spirited debate here and on The Tyee - a few points need to be made:<br /><br />First - taxpayers DO underwrite the BC film industry. For those who didn't check the link, please read this from BC Film & Media:<br /><br />"The Production Services Tax Credit (PSTC)<br /><br />How the PSTC Works<br /><br />The PSTC is a refundable corporate income tax credit.<br /><br />When filing tax returns, production corporations may claim a specified percentage of the labour costs incurred in making film, television, digital animation or visual effects productions.<br /><br />The credits are applied to reduce tax payable, and any remaining balance is paid to the corporation.<br /><br />There is no limit on the PSTC that may be claimed on a particular production and there is no limit that a corporation or group of corporations can claim."<br /><br />So as I wrote, taxpayers give film corporations 1/3 of their labour costs - period. The BC government writes them cheques.<br /><br />Is it worth giving that amount of money to keep jobs in BC? That's the question we need to answer.<br /><br />I am very sympathetic to film industry workers - they didn't create this situation and they don't control it.<br /><br />But to claim that the tax credit isn't a subsidy is absurd.<br /><br />And to claim it is sustainable to pay 1/3 of the labour costs of one small sector of the economy and to even increase that percentage further to match other jurisdictions every time they sweeten the pot is also ludicrous.<br /><br />I ask those who support the tax credit subsidies if they would put any limit on them? $500 million a year? $1 billion?<br /><br />Make the tax credit 50% and we'd get even more work - temporarily and at an enormous cost per job.<br /><br />The answer isn't to match all competing jurisdictions no matter what - we can't win a fight that never ends.<br /><br />BC's film industry needs a thoughtful, sustainable plan - not knee jerk panic that only benefits Hollywood's biggest corporations.Bill Tielemanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03304971610140279157noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-16001442050595337212013-01-23T18:26:48.999-08:002013-01-23T18:26:48.999-08:00There is a difference between a refundable tax cre...There is a difference between a refundable tax credit and a non refundable tax credit. The BC film industry has a refundable tax credit which means if they have tax credits worth more than their taxes they get a check from the government for the remainder.<br /><br />The tax credits the industry gets is more than all the taxes paid by all the BC people that work for the companies getting tax credits. <br /><br />The annual cost of the tax credits is $265 million, or more than $70,000 per BC person employed full time in the film industry.<br /><br /> Bernardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15951619465188564252noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-14906677268455225982013-01-23T17:13:25.532-08:002013-01-23T17:13:25.532-08:0011 millions for a Bollywood event may make us a pr...11 millions for a Bollywood event may make us a profit, but don't hold our breathNot anon DPLnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-21758545285954890062013-01-23T15:10:47.469-08:002013-01-23T15:10:47.469-08:00Forestry, mining, oil and gas industries all get p...Forestry, mining, oil and gas industries all get provincial tax credits as well, and if this government wants to help the economy, and the debt, keeping people employed at NO COST to the tax taxpayers is a good way to do that. ONCE AGAIN. I REPEAT: film tax incentives result in NET TAX GAINS, which is precisely what we need in this tight economy. Also, less unemployment, and more provincial and federal tax revenue are a direct result of film tax incentives.blanonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-4958462698980541062013-01-23T14:21:27.599-08:002013-01-23T14:21:27.599-08:00"I suppose you feel it's ok for our Premi... "I suppose you feel it's ok for our Premier to have invested millions in Bollywood this week?!?!"<br />No where in the article does it say that Mr.T supports government money for Bollywood. Where do you get this belief? Please ask before you assume.<br />I personally believe that government has no business giving tax incentives to a select few. It should be all or nothing for everyone. Doing it piecemeal, pitting government after government, promotes the race to the bottom. "Amazing industry?" Being a former backgrounder, I did find it quite interesting, but as far as pay, it was a joke. Plus it was known that many working there were substance abusers. Right now this province is running a massive debt load. I think the government of the day should be more concerned about debt reduction and stay out of private enterprise. BTW, I am in no way a Clark supporter.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-32578625141216769552013-01-23T14:17:12.002-08:002013-01-23T14:17:12.002-08:00Mr. Bill, we are not asking for a "BAILOUT&qu...Mr. Bill, we are not asking for a "BAILOUT". We are not asking to be "SUBSIDIZED". We are asking for a level playing field with the rest of the provinces in Canada offering tax credits far in excess of what this Province and current government are offering.We are not looking for a hand out, we are asking that people who come here and SPENDING production dollars here get the same discount/tax breaks that are offered in other provinces in Canada.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-47697083259526997022013-01-23T14:16:43.888-08:002013-01-23T14:16:43.888-08:00The film industry is not asking for subsidies. we...The film industry is not asking for subsidies. we're asking for incentives to be increased slightly. there is a HUGE difference. there is no cost to taxpayers with incentives. the media is trying to make it look like we're asking for a handout. We are not asking for subsidies. This LIE is being repeated in order to upset the general public and sensationalize the story. Film tax incentives actually result in a profit to the tax payer. and jobs. and business. that's what the government claims to support. we're offering them an opportunity to do that, at no cost to taxpayers.<br /><br />Take the oil pipeline proposal, the BC government expects to bring just over $1 billion into the economy in 17 years with that project. The film industry brings in that much EVERY YEAR, at no net cost to the taxpayer. That's the story people need to know.TiredofLiesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-52932539643301844452013-01-23T14:13:35.755-08:002013-01-23T14:13:35.755-08:00Clearly, you don't get the difference between ...Clearly, you don't get the difference between an outright subsidy (i.e. bailout or handout) vs. tax credit. The film industry is requesting better tax credits, not a handout. What this means, in plain English is: A film production company comes in, produces a major multi-million dollar film, hires tons of local people, has to pay to build sets, (carpenters are employed, basic labourers, local restaurants and cafes are used, etc etc.). At the end of spending their millions -- note, at the end, once the money has been spent here -- they then file for a tax rebate on the amount they paid. <br /><br />The province still profits millions (and on a large scale billions) even with the rebate. Tax credits/rebates are used in many industries. Even outright subsidies are! (and again, they are not asking for this) -- Oil, forestry, etc. The film industry employs over 25 000 people directly and indirectly with "spin off" jobs, closer to 70 000 more. Billions are injected into the economy -- and, it's all clean and green, too. <br /><br />Thinking of the industry as a bunch of rich actors or hollywood moguls is babyish and ignorant. The vast majority of the industry is comprised of regular men and women just like you, who work hard jobs as labourers, set designers, set construction workers, lighting workers, grips, technicians, etc. etc. etc. They have families, kids in schools, give to charity etc. -- in other words, have livelihoods they cannot simply pack up and move. <br /><br />It is criminal to sit back (and scoff), watching such a successful industry crash and burn so quickly, simply because the province does not want to adapt with current times and adjust their policies accordingly -- which, again, will *not* cost the province. Again, doing so will only benefit the province, and result in a profit of billions into the economy as well as employment for thousands and thousands of its residents.Goldienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-76420940928557332672013-01-23T13:52:17.727-08:002013-01-23T13:52:17.727-08:00Characterizing a tax credit as a "Bail out&qu...Characterizing a tax credit as a "Bail out" is very misleading.<br />I think we should also remember that if you create jobs for Britsh Columbians, they pay taxes. It seems to me increased tax credits will mean less tax revenue from film producers, but more tax paying workers. No increased tax credits means productions go elsewhere and you lose ALL the tax revenue from the producers and the tax revenue for the people that would have worked on the production.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-54257014131465242372013-01-23T13:11:15.436-08:002013-01-23T13:11:15.436-08:00The BC Tax Credit is a fully refundable one, this ...The BC Tax Credit is a fully refundable one, this means if it is more than the taxes owed, the government sends you a cheque<br /><br />How the PSTC Works<br />The PSTC is a refundable corporate income tax credit. When filing tax returns, production corporations may claim a specified percentage of the labour costs incurred in making film, television, digital animation or visual effects productions. The credits are applied to reduce tax payable, andBernardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15951619465188564252noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35935973.post-73522367305381384862013-01-23T12:10:34.476-08:002013-01-23T12:10:34.476-08:00I love how people keeping saying the film industry...I love how people keeping saying the film industry wants money. We are not asking for the government to write a cheque...we are asking for tax credit. If there is no more industry here then they and we the people of this province lose billions period. Ever production that is made here supports ton of local buisness including all the lumber purchased to build sets. Everyone will feel the loss of this amazing industry. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com